Her Name Was Jyoti

Mourners at a candlelight vigil
Photo – latimes.com

A woman lies naked on the side of the road.

She is bleeding profusely. The flash of headlights rushing by barely registers and she can hear the screams from her friend, who seems to be asking for help. He sounds like a broken record. She vaguely remembers them beating him, and trying to call the police on her mobile phone. That was before they had snatched the phone from her hands and moved on to her.

Another pair of headlights goes by, even faster this this time, her friend’s shouts growing weaker. She knows his last pleas are ignored as she feels a layer of dirt and rocks kick off the tires of the passing vehicle and hit her tender skin in a light hailstorm of earth. She wanders in and out of consciousness, barely aware of time. The minutes seem like hours, the hours feel like days.

Yesterday feels like it was a lifetime ago.

She thinks of her family. She tries to find comfort in the things she loves. Her movies. Her friends. She and her friend were just coming back from seeing “The Life of Pi,” one of her favorite books. She won’t let her mind go back to what happened after that. Somewhere between when she boarded the bus and when they threw her and her friend out of the bus. She can’t think about what just happened to her and the men who did it to her. Each memory feels like another wound, another blow, another thrust.

Into nothingness.

The world goes black.

A woman lies naked on the side of the road.

She is struggling to breathe, not realizing that she is slowly dying. Inside she feels like she might be dead already. At one point, as the men handed her off from one to the other, she had stopped fighting. She could never win, physically, this she knew. She had heard the men encouraging each other, congratulating each other after each had their turn with her. She had felt their flesh and the the unyielding stabs of the metal stick they had violated her with.

She wanders in and out of blackness. Is this it? Is this how it ends? she thinks. I am someone’s sister. I am someone’s daughter. I am someone’s friend. I had thought that maybe one day, I would be someone’s wife. Someone’s mother. Someone’s grandmother.

I was not supposed to die like this, she thinks. Not like this. Not today. As someone’s nobody. That much she knows. That much they cannot take away from her. She knows she is worth more than this, that this is not her shame. 

A woman lies naked on the side of the road.

Her insides have been crushed by the iron rod that was ruthlessly thrust into her again and again and again. Several organs have been ruptured and damaged, which explains the flood of blood surrounding her,  surrounding her naked body. The police will finally come, though there is some confusion about how to get her to the hospital it seems, and discussion of whose jurisdiction this falls into. She can hear the sirens and her friend yelling, “Bachao! Bachao!” (Save us. Save us) and someone seems to finally have heard. She does not know that by the time she makes it to the hospital it will be too late. Two hours too late to prevent her death.

A woman lies naked on the side of the road.

Her name is Jyoti.

And it was NOT her day to die.

******************************

The media has been covering the brutal murder and rape that occurred in New Delhi last week and took the life of a 23 year old woman. The woman’s father has decided to come out and publicly announce to the world that he is not ashamed to tell the world his daughter’s name. He wants her to be known as more than the woman who was gang-raped and killed in New Delhi. He wants to give other rape victim’s the courage to step forward to reveal their identities and to not live in shame of the crimes committed against them, not BY them.

The woman’s name is Jyoti Singh Pandey. She was 23 years old.

This piece is a work of fiction. None of us will ever know Jyoti’s thoughts or the terror she went through on that night. It is a torment that no woman should ever bear. When the official death of this woman, this CHILD, was announced last week, not only did her family mourn. Strangers from around the world mourned and grieved with them.

They grieved for a nameless woman.

And now we grieve for a girl with a name. Below is an image of Jyoti’s father who came forward to announce that his daughter’s name should be known.

 

There is something about the look in his eyes that I feel has haunted me since I saw his face in the article by The Mirror yesterday. They speak of a grief in this world that no man or woman should have to bear. I pray for Jyoti’s family that they will find a way to honor her memory and that seeing Jyoti’s name will bring other victims forwards. I pray that her friend recovers and can live his life without being forever haunted by the horror of that night.

I pray that this tragedy sparks a revolution in this world. Let nobody shy away from railing against the injustice of these travesties.

Every rape victim on this earth is somebody’s everything.

It is little wonder that rape is one of the least-reported crimes. Perhaps it is the only crime in which the victim becomes the accused and, in reality, it is she who must prove her good reputation, her mental soundness, and her impeccable propriety.” – Freda Adler

In memory and honor of Jyoti Singh Pandey. R.I.P.

62 Responses to Her Name Was Jyoti

  • theREALdeal says:

    This is sad, but what’s sadder is the way society lets pressure in men build so much that it bubbles over and men see this as their only option to release it, when they see a pretty girl on the street.

    The way to change this , is women as a whole have to begin treating men as a whole better, and realize that life isn’t some bollywood movie.

    • Nicole says:

      Please tell me you are kidding. That this is some sick, twisted joke. This is in no way women’s fault. It is in no way something “built” in men that they’re releasing by violating women.

      No. No. NO. NO.
      Nicole recently posted…Homeschool, ahoy!My Profile

      • theREALdeal says:

        Yes yes YES YES.

        If the idea of flirting and “going for it” with a woman isn’t built up in men maybe you can explain this?

        http://youtu.be/b4hNaFkbZYU

        I’m not saying it’s the fault of THIS woman. Rather (partially) the fault of women as a whole (and in India, where I’ve been many times) the fault of the all-or-none mentality of Bollywood.

        Now, you can do one of two things

        1. Keep claiming that I’m trying to “blame the victim” and let the situation continue and happen again (by the way gang rapes in India are common, this one is getting attention because it happened within the boundaries of the capital)

        2. Try and understand that women actually DO contribute to the problem by their “sending signals” , “not being direct” and the general frustrations created by a hyper-Bollywoodized culture with “item songs” but no culture of dating/flirting/sexual contact between men and women.

        Hows that for a homeschool.

        • sandy says:

          Tragedies like this happen because unfortunately, we share a world with assholes like therealdeal :(. hopefully the ttherealdeal is NOT a woman and doesn’t have any women in their lives. the biggest problem is lack of education!! india needs to step up and educate the people.

          • theREALdeal says:

            Yep that’s it, go ahead and take the easy way out. Call me a rapist or say I’m blaming the victim or whatever, and just watch the same thing happen again and again. OR. try and understand the problem is bigger than a knee-jerk reaction of “ugh these guys are assholes! they should be strung up!” and who knows, you might actually do yourself a favor?

            If someone was struggling with a diet, would you take that person to an all-you-can-eat buffet? Sure, you should have the ABILITY and the RIGHT to do it, that doesn’t make it a smart thing to do, now does it?

            Also, go read up on “broken windows” theory as well. Ironic that someone named “Sandy” writes this, I bet you think if all we do is get rid of “people like Adam Lanza” we’ll stop all school shootings as well.

          • theREALdeal says:

            maybe you can explain this also:

            http://youtu.be/nT5eGxeXKfI

            Woman is groped/assaulted : 0:04 0:33 0:50 1:45 3:30
            Threatening to beat her: 0:02 4:33
            “eve teasing” 1:55
            ridiculing her attempts to stop the harassments 3:37

            At :50 she pushes him off, says “no”, video should end there right ? No means no , right?

            This entire video is “eve teasing” is it not?

          • masalachica says:

            Wow. I know that movie. “Dil.” Madhuri Dixit and Amir Khan. Do you speak Hindi? Do you know what he’s actually saying, by the way? So is this the game you’re playing? Pointing out obscure video clips from Bollywood movies and acts of C-list comedians. We can play this game all day, but it’s not going to change anything.

            Yes.

          • theREALdeal says:

            Louis CK is C-list? now you’ve lost any sense of credibility you might’ve had. Winning an Emmy, having your own tv show, single hour specials, and booking sold out shows is C-list ?

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_C.K.

            I don’t speak Hindi, but that’s irrelevant, the entire video is “eve teasing” can we agree on that?

            Let me ask you a question, lets say I came to you and said,

            “Hey Kiran, I was robbed last night, I was walking through a bad neighborhood, with 100 bills taped to every part of my body, and walking around screaming ‘I’m RICH !”"

            Now, you’re telling me, you wouldn’t even think to ask, once

            “Umm. why did you do that?”

            Rather you’d say “you have every right to do that! if people rob you then THEY have to change, it presumes their natural state is robbery!”

          • masalachica says:

            I’ve lost credibility? Are you kidding me?

            You think this is a conversation? This is not a conversation. You are throwing out ridiculous examples to say women are promoting rape. You are nuts. There I said it.

            People like you are the problem. Those men on the bus raped a woman. No I do not forgive them. I don’t think hanging them solves the problem. (By the way, where are you coming up with some of this shit? Did I say that?)

            Are you going to start sending me porn next and saying look, “there’s jenna jamison, just asking for it.”

            As for people laughing in an audience, you think laughter confirms validity? You think if the ku klux klan is in a convention center and people cheer and holler, that it makes the point “right?”

            You have some messed up logic.

          • theREALdeal says:

            Would you consider this an act of rape:

            http://youtu.be/9F6fbtgJDrg?t=28s

            How about this:

            http://youtu.be/CHt5d7CSBBA

            both of these women in these scenes should have walked off set after reading the script.

          • theREALdeal says:

            “You think this is a conversation? This is not a conversation. You are throwing out ridiculous examples to say women are promoting rape. You are nuts. There I said it.”

            Oh. never heard that one before.

            I’m not saying women are promoting rape (at least not directly as you imply) I’m saying men AND WOMEN contribute to a society/culture in which men are NOT given a clear direction as to how to act with women. So that bubbles over and when some guys get enough alcohol in them, it results in horrible acts. There is a difference between saying “women are at fault” and “women contribute” learn that difference.

            “(By the way, where are you coming up with some of this shit? Did I say that?)”

            Not you, others on this forum and elsewhere. But while we’re on that topic, what do you think is punishment befitting the men on the bus?

            “As for people laughing in an audience, you think laughter confirms validity?”

            Umm.. yea? actually it does. Why would you laugh at something you didn’t at a subconscious level agree with or acknowledge as having a truism ? LIke this joke:

            “You think if the ku klux klan is in a convention center and people cheer and holler, that it makes the point “right?””

            Well, it’s “right” in the mind of the audience if thats what they do. I’m sure everyone at a klan rally agrees pretty heartily with the jokes and points dispensed by the speakers there. So now what, are you saying the entire audience at that performance were rapists? Please, you’ve descended into complete illogic.

            By the way, you never answered my question about the 100 bills:

            Do I have the right to walk in a bad neighborhood at 3:00 am, wearing 100 dollar bills on my chest, screaming I’m rich ? and not get robbed?

            You or none of the other women here would ask, “uhh, yea, why exactly did you do that?”

            Notice, I’m not talking about going out and screaming “Rob me!” i’m talking about going out and showing the world what I have.

          • masalachica says:

            Have a nice life, theREALdeal. I am not going to argue with stupid. Which you are. As for “theREALdeal,” not so real when you don’t even use your name.

            Sayonara, asshole.

          • theREALdeal says:

            Here’s another example of “violent imagery” against women being glorified – and I’m all for the domestic violence groups, and feminist groups protesting this:

            http://shine.yahoo.com/dailyshot/controversial-magazine-photos-144600821.html

            Try and understand people, none of these things ALONE will have effect, it’s only when its compounded, glorified and sustained over a period of time that it creates an environment.

            But there’s no point if people are just going to keep saying I “blame the woman” and say “it’s the woman’s fault” I thought this forum might have some more elevated thinkers.

          • theREALdeal says:

            “Are you going to start sending me porn next and saying look, “there’s jenna jamison, just asking for it.””

            No because identifying something as “pornography” indicates a level of surrealness, that is disconnected with reality. Such a distinction isn’t made in the examples I’ve quoted earlier.

            Evidenced by this study:

            http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1359178909000445

            But looking at this study;

            http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1359178999000075

            namely:

            “The difficulty of this research is highlighted in a discussion of operational definitions of the term pornography, the choice of proxy measures for sexual offending in experimental research, and the emphasis given sexual assault of adult females over other kinds of criminal sexual behavior such as child molestation, exhibitionism, and voyeurism”

            So the difficulty comes when the lines blur, and if something is considered “mainstream” yet contains highly suggestive material. The study also talks about the male pre-disposition to commit assaults and the presence of prurient material as a catalyst.

            See? this is how someone has a “complex conversation” about this issue. Facts, data, research.

        • theREALdeal says:

          “Sayonara, asshole.”

          Great. avoid the question, resort to name calling. Also, never once did I use any kind of gender specific words like “bitch or cunt” or anything like that, yet I was called a “misogynist” yet I’ve been called names here all day long – thereby proving you all are misandrists (yes that word actually exists!)

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misandry

          • Heather says:

            Oh wow, not swearing at us makes you such a nice, sweet guy!

            Stop acting like you’re walking away with your head held high….. Good luck getting laid, ass!

          • theREALdeal says:

            “Oh wow, not swearing at us makes you such a nice, sweet guy!”

            Never said I was either of those, I’m just an honest respectful guy, that wants to have an honest discussion, and speak what’s on his mind, not just say what women want to hear in hopes of getting laid.

            And still. I have yet to have anyone answer the $100 bill question. I’ll post it again:

            “Do I have the right to walk in a bad neighborhood at 3:00 am, wearing 100 dollar bills on my chest, screaming I’m rich ? and not get robbed?

            You or none of the other women here would ask, “uhh, yea, why exactly did you do that?””

          • Kristin says:

            You’ve had your say. Your logic is severely flawed and twisted and perpetuates the myth that rape is somehow the woman’s fault. Therefore, people don’t agree with you. Deal with it and move on.

            In other words, stop being a troll.

          • Sig
            Twitter:
            says:

            One quick thing – many people point this analogy between robbery and rape and fail to realise one thing – women are NOT property! Walking down a dark street, flirting with a guy, wearing short skirts still doesn’t mean you ask for it or are “contributing” to men’s apparent inability to control their own urges. You cannot make a parallel between this. Rape isn’t about sex at all – it’s about power and inflicting that power in the worst way possible.

            The thing about this rape case is that it has brought forth so many underlying factors that make up the rape culture there – and yes, I agree Bollywood films have a part to play in that in what they have done to show women in the light of either the secy “item” girl or the “good” heroine. But, again – NOT the women’s fault – you think honestly (especially back in the 90′s where those eve-teasing songs were the norm) women actually had much of a choice in their scripts and roles?? Do you think they have that now? Bollywood films portray a fantasy in the same way I guess you could say hip-hop music videos.

            But anyways – you seem to think you know a lot about India but what about everything else? Have you considered that? The corrupt politicians & ineffective police force? The overwhelming stigma of rape and miniscule chances for victims to get justice and rehabilitation while the rapists usually go scot-free? The lack of privacy and respect for personal space and identity? The decades-old attitude towards women from both women and men that deems them to be lesser human beings than men through patriarchal oppression under the guise of customs and “tradition”? The increasingly disproportionate gap between traditional and modern India (seriously regional leaders are saying that women are banned from wearing jeans and using mobile phone because THAT’s what causes rapes. Of COURSE. *facepalm*)?

            What about the message that gets ingrained in every woman to “not get raped” rather than to men to “not rape”?? It seems pretty similar to what you are saying right there as well.

            All of these I believe have some blame in creating the India that we have now. I alternate between feeling extreme helplessness and frustration and then thinking “India is fucked” because the reality is that change – if it comes – is long and torturous and will be so, so difficult. In the meantime, many more children, girls and women will be assaulted and raped and people will, with the passing of time, forget about this one brave girl.
            Sig recently posted…Pregnancy Diaries – Week 27My Profile

  • Naomi
    Twitter:
    says:

    Thank you for writing this. I’ve had an ache inside since all of this came to light … partially because of our connection to Delhi, but more so because of my shared connection with her parents. We all have a responsibility to raise our children better. It has been playing over and over in my mind as I finish raising my 17 year old boy, my 9 year old boy and my 6 year old daughter.

    I hope everything that you hope, but I also hope that the Delhi government steps up and does the right thing … with the accused and for days/months/years to come.

    (I’m hoping no one graces theREALdeal’s comment with a response … )
    Naomi recently posted…Box 53bMy Profile

    • theREALdeal says:

      I’m still waiting for an explanation of this by the way:

      http://youtu.be/b4hNaFkbZYU

      I bet you teach your son to respect women, I was taught the same way, yet all we hear FROM women is “to go for it” How’s that for confusion?

      • Nicole says:

        What explanation do you want? That girl, if she actually exists, has a kink. Good for her. Kink is kink. I would never begrudge someone their kink.

        The POINT is that Louis CK is smart enough to know that if a woman pushes you away or says no, you don’t do the thing you were doing. Plain and simple. Where’s the problem?
        Nicole recently posted…A cup a day keeps the monsters awayMy Profile

  • Alison
    Twitter:
    says:

    You will forever live in many hearts and minds, Jyoti.
    I would hate to think though, that you represent those who lost this battle.
    I want to remember you as a symbol of what courage is, what it should look like, and what a family’s love is.
    Rest in peace, Jyoti.
    Alison recently posted…Do. Or When The Easy Becomes DifficultMy Profile

  • I’m so glad her dad came out and reveled her name so she wouldn’t be referred to as the girl who was gang raped. really sick what these assholes did. your article is raw… it hits a nerve… i was so sad when i heard about this incident, i can’t even imagine the pain and trauma this poor girl went thru. i hope they burn in hell. very well written… i’m glad you were raw.
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  • Kristin
    Twitter:
    says:

    I was so happy – perhaps happy is the wrong word – I was so proud of Jyoti’s father when he came forward to honor his daughter. Giving a name and a face and a family to this crime is so important to those who have been through similar situations. That he claims her and celebrates her in the face of the violence and horror that was her death is heartening to those who would attempt to hide her away.

    Thank you for this post.
    Kristin recently posted…Lament: The Art of Research Lost and FoundMy Profile

  • Manish Anand says:

    It is pathetic that after all this incident we Indians are still dramatic.. The representative in government chosen by us the common are the face of our society ,, as per their statement this all happened is not a big deal ,,, have some quotes from their mouths..is this real India we are living …

    India is still shocked and numbed at the death of the Delhi gangrape victim. People have called for the government to honour the woman and punish her assaulters quickly. It’s an issue which needs to be dealt with tact and sensitivity-but our leaders may need a crash course in diplomacy.
    From the President’s son to party leaders, politicians have been speaking about women and rape. Here are what some leaders said:
    Abhijit Mukherjee:
    Speaking to a Bengali-language television channel in his earlier assembly constituency Nalhati in Birbhum district, Abhijit Mukherjee, son of President Pranab Mukherjee, said on Christmas day that “highly dented-painted” women visited discotheques and then appeared at India Gate to protest the Delhi bus gang-rape.
    “What’s basically happening in Delhi is somewhat like Egypt or elsewhere, where there was something called the Spring Revolution, which has very little connection with ground realities. In India, staging candle-light marches, going to discotheques – we did all this during our student life too, we were students too – I know very well what kind of character students should have,” Abhijit said.
    “Those who claim to be students – I can see many beautiful women among them they were highly dented-painted – they’re giving interviews on TV, they’ve brought their children to show them the scenes,” he said.
    “I have grave doubts whether they’re students because women of that age are generally not students,” said Abhijit, who was elected an MP from Jangipur Lok Sabha seat in Murshidabad to fill up the vacancy caused by his father’s elevation to the presidency. He later apologised for his remarks.
    Anisur Rahman:
    CPI-M leader Anisur Rahman had ridiculed the Banerjee government’s decision to compensate victims of crimes against women like rape and trafficking.
    “We have told the chief minister in the assembly that the government will pay money to compensate rape victims. What is your fee? If you are raped, what will be your fee?,” asked Anisur Dec 25.
    “As an opposition leader, she took along Champala Sardar from South 24 Parganas district to the state secretariat, claiming she was raped.”
    “We then told her: “Don’t bring such hela fela meye (girls without any position in society). Bring some good girls.”
    “And there can be no better girl than you. You can say you have been raped. We ask, didi moni (elder sister), what is your fee? How much will you take for getting raped,” he asked.
    Mohan Bhagwat:
    RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat had claimed that the incidents of rape were the result of adoption of western culture in society as a whole and that erosion of traditional Indian values were more pronounced in urban areas.
    “Crimes against women happening in urban India are shameful. It is a dangerous trend. But such crimes won’t happen in Bharat or the rural areas of the country. You go to villages and forests of the country and there will be no such incidents of gangrape or sex crimes,” he had said.
    “Where ‘Bharat’ becomes ‘India’ with the influence of western culture, these type of incidents happen. The actual Indian values and culture should be established at every stratum of society where women are treated as ‘mother’,” Bhagwat added.
    Kailash Vijayvargiya:
    When asked to comment on recent sexual harassment cases in the country, with Madhya Pradesh in particular, BJP leader Kailash Vijayvargiya said: “Ek hi shabd hai – maryada. Maryada ka ulanghan hota hai, toh Sita-haran ho jata hai. Laxmanrekha har vyakti ki khichi gayi hai. Us Laxmanrekha ko koi bhi par karega, toh Ravan samne baitha hai. woh Sita-haran karke le jayega”. (Whenever people cross their limitations, deterioration is bound to happen. It applies to everyone in the society. Whoever breaches the line, he/she will confront a Ravan)
    The minister’s remark drew sharp reaction from political parties as it triggered protests in the state and across nation causing major embarassment for BJP.
    Botsa Satyanarayana:
    Andhra Pradesh Congress Committee president Botsa Satyanarayana termed the Delhi gangrape incident a minor one and questioned the need for women to be out at midnight. He later withdrew his statement.
    “Just because India got freedom at midnight, is it necessary for women to move on the streets at midnight?” he asked.
    Botsa expressed the view that the woman should not have boarded a private bus at such an odd hour. “She should have assessed the situation before getting into the bus,” he said.
    “Though it was a minor incident, UPA chairperson Sonia Gandhi was gracious enough to intervene and hold negotiations with the protestors to bring the situation under control. It is highly commendable on the part of Sonia to respond to the situation so quickly,” he said.
    Dr Kakoli Ghosh Dastidar:
    Senior Trinamool Congress leader Dr Kakoli Ghosh Dastidar speaking to a news channel said, “If you’re referring to the Park Street rape, see that is a different case altogether. That was not at all a rape case. It was a misunderstanding between the two parties involved between a lady and her client. This was not a rape.”
    She made this comment while reacting to another obscene comment made by senior CPI(M) leader Anisur Rehman on chief minister Mamata Banerjee.
    Ashok Singhal:
    After RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat’s remarks that rapes were prevalent in India and not in Bharat, the Vishwa Hindu Parishad on Saturday blamed the ‘western model’ of lifestyle for growing incidents of sexual assault on women including rape, saying cities were losing the values.
    VHP international advisor Ashok Singhal termed as “alarming” the western model of living, which he said had been imbibed from the US.
    “This western model is alarming. What is happening is we have imbibed the US. We have lost all the values we had in cities,” Singhal told reporters in response to a question on the growing rape incidents in the country.
    He particularly faulted the live-in relationship style when he said “it is not only foreign to our culture, but also hostile.”
    Virginity was preserved. But the purity has been totally disturbed (now)…we are losing it,” he said.
    Puducherry government:
    In a regressive move, the Puducherry government has reportedly suggested redesigning of school uniforms to make it mandatory for girl students to wear overcoats to prevent sexual crimes.
    “The meeting resolved to introduce overcoats for girl students, operate special buses for them and ban mobile phones in schools. Our government is committed to ensuring safety of women, particularly girl students,” school education minister T Thiagarajan said
    Thiagarajan reportedly also said the government will operate exclusive buses for girl students from the next academic yearhavign only women conductors.
    Asaram Bapu:
    Spiritual Guru Asaram Bapu has landed himself in a controversy over his remark that the December 16 Delhi gang rape victim is as guilty as those responsible for the barbaric sexual assault on her. “Only 5-6 people are not the culprits. The victim daughter is as guilty as her rapists…
    She should have called the culprits brothers and begged before them to stop… This could have saved her dignity and life. Can one hand clap? I don’t think so,” Media reports quoted Asaram Bapu, as saying.
    According to media reports, the self-proclaimed godman further said that he is against harsher punishments for the accused as the law could be misutilised.
    “We have often seen such laws are made to be misutilised… Dowry harassment law is the biggest example,” he said.
    Raj Thackeray:
    Maharashtra Navnirman Sena chief Raj Thackeray has blamed “Bihari” migrants for the recent case of gangrape of a girl in New Delhi. “All are talking about the Delhi gangrape, but nobody is asking from where these men came. No one is asking who did this. So many cases are slapped against me (for speaking
    against Biharis) but no one is talking about the fact that all these rapists are from Bihar,” he said, addressing a public function in suburban Goregaon last night.
    “The system has collapsed,” Raj said.

  • Ilene
    Twitter:
    says:

    Oh, Kiran, your fictional piece is a beautiful sad tribute to that child who never should have died. why are we not fighting for things like this? Fighting like bloody maniacs? Fighting like the members of the NRA fight to protect their guns?????
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  • Galit Breen
    Twitter:
    says:

    Absolutely heart breaking.
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  • Brittany
    Twitter:
    says:

    Oh Kiran this was heartbreaking and the real life story already broke my heart. I cannot understand the group mentality that would cause these men to be so cruel. I cannot imagine how they could live a day after destroying her young body and ending her life. I cannot imagine her father’s grief. Every day I am online and paying attention in the world there are stories that make me a fighter because I am angered that things like this can happen and then there are stories of love and support that make me glad to be a part of this community that shares the good and the bad, helping to right wrongs and lift up those who need it. Thank you so much for writing this and sharing your grief, which most of the world shares. Those who blame this at all on the victim have lost their way.
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  • This hits a little too close to home for me. Raped at 17, no one believed me. And while I wasn’t killed, I was emotionally ruined for a long time. I am so proud of Jyoti’s FATHER for speaking out against the madness, on behalf of his daughter. I am so ashamed that people still use their bodies like weapons against young girls, against anyone. Thank you for writing this piece. For making me remember. People keep telling me: O e day, maybe you will forget. But the memory is an obligation. It connects me to other women, and I must speak out on their behalf and turn this old wound into a battle cry. Great post, Kiran.
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  • Khushboo says:

    I was extremely disgusted when I first heard about this case and that level of disgust has only increased with the days. I might be Indian but am ashamed of the way the government has handled this case. The death penalty may not be enforced in India but if ever they needed an excuse/reason to introduce it in the country, this case would be it. My heart reaches out to Jyoti’s family and while that situation cannot be changed, we need to prevent the same incident from occurring again.
    Khushboo recently posted…Makeup MondayMy Profile

    • theREALdeal says:

      “My heart reaches out to Jyoti’s family and while that situation cannot be changed, we need to prevent the same incident from occurring again.”

      You’re right, and how do we do that? Just repeatedly call the guys who did it “assholes” and “crazies” and say they should be “hanged from the highest tree” ? No. maybe we try and understand the CONDITIONS from which that type of thinking arose, and what made them think it was ok, and they could brazenly get away with it ?

      Of course, for this you’ll have to get over the initial ” booo boo what are you doing? blaming the victim? boo boo”

      • masalachica says:

        Hi theREALdeal,

        I saw your comment last night when I went to bed and I did not respond because, truthfully, it did and does disturb me. I do not interpret your response as saying that there is NOT a problem. You seem to fully acknowledge that there is a problem, and on that point, we both seem to agree. In fact, everyone on this thread does I think.

        Where we differ is in the cause of the issue. You believe that the cause of this issue is related to a sexually charged culture created by Bollywood and perhaps Hollywood as well. On top of that, it seems that you also find a core part of the problem to be the way that women treat men. You also continue to reference a video that is very singularly focused – it’s a comedian delivering a joke about a woman he met during a one-night stand who enjoys rough sex and fantasizes about being raped. You seem to hold this video in high esteem, as if it puts a tight lens on our society and the problem.

        As if this woman, combined with Bollywood is the problem.

        My answer may seem lengthy so apologies. I know that most rape incidents in India and other South Asian and Middle Eastern countries don’t often receive attention. That this case did receive the media blitz it is getting is a step in the right direction – it gives context to the thousands of nameless victims that are raped, impregnated or sometimes murdered the world over.

        Jyoti’s story is but one. The 15 year old girl in the Maldives, whose father repeatedly raped her and made her pregnant? Well, she is going to be publicly flogged for “inciting” the rape. Do you know that in certain villages in Zimbabwe, young girls are raped as early as a day old The elders in the village advise the men that raping virgins is a way to cleanse their body of AIDS.

        Day old babies, theREALdeal.

        I don’t know if I understand your analogies about the school shooting and the “all you can eat buffet.”

        1)Adam Lanza had a mental illness and we need to be more cognizant of treating mental illness and removing the stigma associated to it. We also need to address gun regulation in this country. This is a complex conversation and deserves to be more than just a point you throw out so casually, as you did in your statement.

        2) I like alcohol. But if I am an alcoholic, I must take responsibility for that. I like eating, but if I become fat, I must take responsibility for that. If you put a gun in my hand, I have the choice to shoot or give it back. Women are not something that you serve up to men. Even if their skirt is short. Even if they are so pretty it makes your heart beat out if it’s chest. Even if her smile seems inviting. Even if she reminds you of the girl you never could get.

        If you take a woman against her will, it is rape. And it is NOT her fault.

        We do not agree on the cause. At all. We do not agree on the solution. At all. I do not care that a woman named Sandy writes something which I disagree with. No two women are alike. There is no irony in the fact that amongst the billions of people in the world, not everybody thinks the same way.

        I think we understand your point. I do not think you are a rapist or condone rape. But I do believe we will always differ on our P.O.V.

        Thanks for your P.O.V., but please understand that it may not resonate with this audience and it’s unlikely to change our minds.

        Kiran

        • theREALdeal says:

          “and does disturb me.”

          It disturbs me also. Doesn’t make it untrue.

          “You believe that the cause of this issue is related to a sexually charged culture created by Bollywood and perhaps Hollywood as well. On top of that, it seems that you also find a core part of the problem to be the way that women treat men.”

          Yes, absolutely, that is a core part. Look, everyone *knows* it’s wrong, but they do it anyway. So the question is why? and how? and what allows them to think they can get away with it? Everyone says “education is the issue!” Umm hello. not it’s not. Those guys on the bus weren’t thinking, “gee I wonder if this is right or not?” This reminds me of these stupid sexual harassment trainings they give at companies, like “OH! you mean I’m NOT supposed to grab her ass when I want?!”

          Secondly, bollywood is an entity that is supported by both men AND women. The all you can eat buffet part was saying that even though it’s perfectly legal and “right” to create an environment of temptation, it doesn’t make it a smart thing to do. do you want to discuss practical solutions? or discuss what’s “right” and “should be”

          “You also continue to reference a video that is very singularly focused – it’s a comedian delivering a joke about a woman he met during a one-night stand who enjoys rough sex and fantasizes about being raped.”

          And did you happen to notice the audience laughing? If you knew anything about comedy, you know that we as an audience laugh at jokes (especially from standup comedians – ie strangers we don’t know anything about, other than what they are saying) we find *relatable* meaning, if the joke doesn’t have a larger sense of truth to it, no one would find it funny. But the joke IS funny. Every woman in there should have stood up and walked out saying “this is proposterous! how dare he say a woman wants to be raped!” Yet that didn’t happen, now did it?

          As for the “singular focus”, hello, every encounter is singularly focused! Louis CK is a well traveled man, but Im sure he hasn’t found the only woman in the world who thinks that way.

          “If you take a woman against her will, it is rape. And it is NOT her fault.”

          Really, and yet the woman in Louis CK’s story wanted just that. To be taken against her will. How’s that for mixed messages?

          And yawn. when did I ever say it was her fault? I never said that and you’re putting words in my mouth.

          “1)Adam Lanza had a mental illness and we need to be more cognizant of treating mental illness and removing the stigma associated to it. We also need to address gun regulation in this country. This is a complex conversation and deserves to be more than just a point you throw out so casually, as you did in your statement.”

          Hah funny, so white boy in USA shoots up a school and it deserves a “complex conversation” but a group of Indian guys rape a woman on a bus in India and they’re just a bunch of “loser idiots that deserve to die!” Institutional/cultural racism much ? Where is all the “complex conversating” as a result of this horrible tragedy? Where’s the discussion about the larger *societal* issues there? Wheres the discussion of the group think, and possible mental illnesses of the men on the bus?

          India actually has it easier in a way, there’s no [official anyway] NRA (National Rapists Association) to lobby for rape the way the NRA in the usa lobbies for guns

          “Women are not something that you serve up to men. Even if their skirt is short. Even if they are so pretty it makes your heart beat out if it’s chest. Even if her smile seems inviting. Even if she reminds you of the girl you never could get.”

          They’re not. I agree. maybe they should stop acting that way themselves, by “serving themselves up” on their own. like for example in this video: (and of course there are 100 others per day I could post, but you get the point)

          http://youtu.be/nT5eGxeXKfI

          Groping her 0:04 0:33 0:50 1:45 3:30
          Threatening to beat her 0:02 4:33
          Commenting on her body to make her feel uncomfortable 1:55
          Ridiculing her attempts to stop the harassments 3:37

          • Heather says:

            TheREALdeal….. I started to read all the replies to this beautiful piece and I got to yours. As a British girl I use sarcasm a lot so I think to myself “wow this guy is really sarcastic” but then I read on and the more I read the more I can feel my stomach clench in disgust to your words. I quickly realised this wasn’t a witty, sarcastic comment. You were serious. Kiran has replied using facts and she has disproved your pathetic mindless comments so I feel no need to go through each of your misogynistic, disgusting sentences to break each one down (also because I do not want to waste more than one post on you).

            All I have to say is I feel sorry for any woman who is within reach of you, if you are married (which I doubt) then I truly pity the woman who has to have “consensual” sex with you and fulfil your dirty fantasies. Rape IS done by sick men, rape IS NOT a woman’s fault. Women fought (and still fight) tooth and nail for equality and freedom, they should not have to fear being dragged off a bus because some men are too animalistic and mentally incapable to be able to walk on by without abusing them.

            I hope you never have a daughter, ass.

          • theREALdeal says:

            well blimey, let me just put on my jumper, take the lift and go on a holiday.

            “Kiran has replied using facts”

            Not a single fact appeared in her post. Please point one out. It was riddled with insults and conjecture, not unlike yours.

            ” Rape IS done by sick men, rape IS NOT a woman’s fault.”

            Yawn. another brainless response. Never once did I say it is “a womans” fault. Learn the difference between contributing to a problem and being at fault for a problem.


            “I quickly realised this wasn’t a witty, sarcastic comment. You were serious.”

            Of course I was, a woman was raped and murdered, I find that to be pretty serious. And I think a real solution involves a real discussion about the issue. By the way, here is a *woman’s* post (since having a penis automatically means you have no credibility to discuss this honestly, apparently) that pretty much echoes mine

            (and she quotes the Louis CK piece, and doesn’t first diminish him as a “C List” comedian then equate him to the KKK, wtf!?)

            http://www.artofflirting.com/rape-is-rape-and-the-shades-of-gray-area

          • theREALdealLivesinFantasy says:

            For being “theREALdeal,” it sure seems like you’re missing the REAL facts.

            After Kiran pointed out,
            “You believe that the cause of this issue is related to a sexually charged culture created by Bollywood and perhaps Hollywood as well. On top of that, it seems that you also find a core part of the problem to be the way that women treat men.”
            You responded by:
            “Yes, absolutely, that is a core part…Those guys on the bus weren’t thinking, “gee I wonder if this is right or not?” This reminds me of these stupid sexual harassment trainings they give at companies, like ‘OH! you mean I’m NOT supposed to grab her ass when I want?!’”

            You completely over-looked anything else Kiran stated. Instead, you keep quoting Louis CK.
            1. A woman STATING she WANTS to be taken against her will…IS CONSENT!
            By saying it’s a mixed message, you don’t seem to understand how language/communication works. The woman stating she wants to be taken against her will…is simply stating, TO THE PERSON OF HER CHOICE, that he has the CONSENT, at in initiated time, to take her by surprise. Since the woman stated her fantasy, it DOES NOT mean, that if she was walking down a street, and a man (or group of men) pulled her onto a bus and raped her, that IT ISN’T RAPE! Which is the situation we have at hand.

            You then say, the guys on the bus weren’t thinking if what they were doing was right or wrong. Wow! HOW PROFOUND!!! No shit they weren’t thinking…and that is where the problem lies. They weren’t thinking; they didn’t have the ability to use proper judgment in a situation that never should have happened. But I’m sure Bollywood is the reason they didn’t think, right?

            Here’s a clue…”Bollywood,” for one, while is probably the best known Indian Cinema Industry (though there are MANY other industries such as Tollywood), it isn’t the only industry that prevails in India. In fact, Hollywood plays a role in India as well. If you feel it’s alright to blame Bollywood for the actions of the situation, I’d say you’re wrong and that it was Hollywood that called for the actions of the situation. Both claims are preposterous anyway.

            You’ve been to India plenty of times…wow. Where did you say? Sounds more like you visited India by staring at a map and went to a few indian restaurants, and spoke to an indian here and there…and called it visiting India. Had you been to India, you’d see how we teach our men to treat women…how to respect women…and so on. Had you been to the India that I’ve been to…to the India that us Indians know…you would’ve seen men and women walking down the street…all part of one group, but the women don’t have their arms around the men…nor the other way around. The men, have their hands around other male cohorts. But I’m sure you just read that as “oh, they’re just openly gay.” Right? No. In fact, the men don’t have their arms around the women of their group, or even if they are walking one on one , OUT OF RESPECT. But that’s how the women are “treating the men poorly…and let’s the pressure in men build,” right?
            I agree with you in that jokes have some sort of underlying truth to them. But once again, you misquoted, and misunderstood language. Listen to the “joke” again. He never stated “every woman wants to be raped.” Which is why the women didn’t walk out. In fact, he stated THAT ONE PARTICULAR WOMAN WANTED TO BE TAKEN BY SURPRISED…if you listened to the joke further, you would have HEARD Louis CK himself state he didn’t have sex with the woman because he thought “She didn’t want to…” Notice how he said, as a WHITE MALE, that the pressure was building…that they were getting really into it and the girl kept swatting away his hand. He then carried on by saying, “What are you, out of your F*in mind? What do you think I’m just going to rape you on the off chance you liked that sh*t? Only in idiot would say, ‘oh I’m getting a rape-y vibe from this girl. I don’t know. I suspect she might enjoy being raped. Maybe that’s her thing. I don’t know. I don’t want to ruin it…” And since you felt the need to bring up laughter of the crowd, once again, I don’t expect you to really figure out what went on there as you can’t comprehend language…the laughter didn’t occur when Louis stated the woman wanted to be raped, it occurred when Louis pointed out the RIDICULOUSNESS of the situation. So before insinuating Kiran, or any of the other readers on here for that matter, don’t know anything about comedy…you may want to take a few classes on what comedy is first.

            “Hah funny, so white boy in USA shoots up a school and it deserves a “complex conversation” but a group of Indian guys rape a woman on a bus in India and they’re just a bunch of “loser idiots that deserve to die!” Institutional/cultural racism much? Where is all the “complex conversating” as a result of this horrible tragedy? Where’s the discussion about the larger *societal* issues there? Wheres the discussion of the group think, and possible mental illnesses of the men on the bus?”

            The complex conversation, theUNrealDeal, is how to stop this from occurring again. How to push gov’t into better educating the population on the situation and how to avoid them from reoccurring. But that’s a stupid tactic…right? Education. I mean, why educate people about rape and the impact it has on not only a family but the community? I mean, that is just like those “stupid sexual harassment videos” at work…right? You also seemed to overlook yet another point…Adam Lanza took his life after his actions…These 4 men and 1 adolescent continued on with their lives…So the Co-Ed rally groups, are calling for harsher punishments…the MEN and women in the rally groups are calling for justice to be served in whatever way they seem deemed right. You also overlook the fact that here in the US, the population TALKS about gun control (even though mental illness is a huge part overlooked) and that’s about it…in India, they not only talk, but they rally…they do something. But that’s not something you’d understand or see.

            “They’re not. I agree. maybe they should stop acting that way themselves, by “serving themselves up” on their own.”

            Who was she? Who made you think that she was “serving herself up to you?” I mean, seriously, that’s your defense? In what way are women “serving themselves up?” I am not saying that there are a few out there that do, but that’s not all…and in cases of RAPE none of the women ever “serve themselves up.” When women want something, they will make it known…when they won’t, they’ll make it known. If you ask, we tell…if we tell, we expect you to listen. And don’t read that as a Male vs. Female situation. We don’t expect just men to treat us like this…we are not dictators…we hold these expectations with women as well.

  • Parita says:

    Thank you for writing this Kiran. I hope the world remembers Jyoti and what she went through so that no woman/girl has to experience something as brutal as this.
    Parita recently posted…Sick All WeekendMy Profile

  • Anna See says:

    thank you for this post, kiran. i think it is so significant and important that jyoti’s father shared her name with us. thank you for drawing us in even more by describing what those moments were most likely like for jyoti. something must change.
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  • dixya
    Twitter:
    says:

    I cant imagine what Jyoti had to go through such inhumane and cruel thing. Those people who put her through so much are not even worthy of being called “human” because no one with heart, soul would do such shameless and disgusting act. I hope that they will regret so much for the rest of their life and suffocate and get disgusted with themselves. It makes me wonder – what could possibly have been going in those sick heads mind and we are not only talking about one sick person-its a group of guys – encouraging, congratulating..since when did insulting, raping, and treating another person like that become an act of celebration – it does not make sense to me at all. That is why I cannot even think of those people as same level as humans, they are evil ass holes with no heart and no soul. They do not deserve to be called humans! The pain in her dads eyes broke my heart and this is the most difficult time for him yet he was a brave dad, brave male, brave person, brave human to come forward and share his daughters name so other daughters, sisters, woman in the world are saved from future incidents like this. My respect and sympathy goes out to that man. No one deserves a death like that and Jyoti, I sincerely hope you are in a better place than this earth which has become so evil and disgusting..
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  • Jennifer says:

    Heart breaking. I’m glad her father is standing up for her.
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  • erin margolin
    Twitter:
    says:

    Heather said it best to TheRealDeal. He is an ass. Kiran, thank you for sharing this wrenching story and I’m sorry this jerk is ruining the otherwise heartfelt comments and discussion. Don’t waste your time replying to him anymore. He’s trolling for attention.

    love to you, and love to Jyoti and her sweet father. they are in my thoughts and prayers.

    xo
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  • Debi (
    Twitter:
    says:

    What a beautifully written and haunting piece. I too am haunted by the look of sadness and pain in her father’s eyes. He looks completely deflated. No parent should ever know the feeling of the loss of their baby because she indeed was his everything.
    Thank you for writing this piece. I think it should be shared over and over again until people realize that women are human and we have feelings and worth and merit and we are all somebody’s everything.
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  • Kristin says:

    This is a beautifully, if hauntingly, written piece of fiction, Kiran. I’m glad that Jyoti’s father chose to publicize his daughter’s name instead of hiding behind the shame of rape that society perpetuates.

    Also? I hope the bastards who did this fry.
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  • F. says:

    I was invited to read this post not only because of its content but mainly because of the argument that is going on here, which is really sad. Sad because the box used for the comments says “Speak your mind” but as soon as people do, they are judged by others who disagree and, instead of a constructive argument, what we see here is a bunch of comments full of insults and whatsoever. Democracy is not only being free to speak your mind, but also to have your point of view RESPECTED, and that is clearly not happening here.

    I didn’t read all the comments ‘cos I have no patience for that, but I know what the discussion is all about.
    I would like to write my opinion here, but I also would like it to be respected.

    I don’t believe in generalization. It’s stupid. You can never say rape is women’s fault but you can’t say rape is done by sick men either and I will explain my point of view.

    I do agree some rapists commit this crime because of some mental disorder that makes them act like that. But that is not a rapist exception… serial killers are also classified in this category and many other kinds of criminals like arsonists and so on. They are usually psychopaths, which means they do not feel guilty. It is obviously not a normal behavior and considering that, should we judge them like normal citizens? If you generalize saying rape is done by SICK men, that means they have a mental disorder and they CAN NOT be judged as merely normal people. They are sick.
    But there’s another point I think… and it lies on the definition of Rape. What is rape for you? Is it when a person is forced to have sexual intercourse. Is that it? Because here, there are a lot of things to be considered.
    I do believe women have a great importance here. Let’s portray it like that: the guy goes out to a party. There he sees tons of women wearing extremely short and tight clothes, behaving like animals, drinking their asses off, dancing on tables, hitchhiking home, sitting on random guys’ laps and so on. He happens to drive one of these girls home – obviously expecting to get something in return. She is too wasted to say “no” but she doesn’t say “yes” either and they end up having sex. Is this a rape? Why or why not? And who’s to blame? You might say the guy was “taking advantage” of her since she was wasted but, let’s be honest! If you can not respect your own image, your own body, how do you expect the others to? And I’m not judging isolated things. I wear short and tight clothes when I go out at night, but I do not behave like an animal, I do not get wasted like I’m unable to tell right from wrong, I do not go home with strangers or anything like that. That would be like parking your car in a dangerous neighborhood and leaving the keys at the door expecting it not to be stolen. Stupid. And in that case, I do think they BOTH are to blame.

    Another situation is some indigenous tribes where the girls HAVE TO get married as soon as they get their first period. Sometimes they are 12 or even younger and they marry older men usually in their 30s. They don’t have a choice, they are “forced” to. Is this rape? If you say yes, you’re being ethnocentric. You’re judging a different culture based on your own, like if your culture was right and theirs was wrong. That doesn’t make any sense.

    Again, I’m not defending anybody I’m just sharing my point of view and hopefully it will be respected.

    • masalachica says:

      Hi F,

      Thank you for visiting and “speaking your mind.” This is my blog and I do not expect everyone to share the same opinion. That being said, there was some friction on this thread, not just because someone had a differing opinion than my own, but because he was also fairly insulting in how he responded when his viewpoint was questioned. As the owner and moderator of this blog, I should have kept my temper in check when I was being derided in that fashion. For that, I am sorry.

      Exhale. Ah. I feel better now :-)

      I think women need to be smart about how they conduct themselves and which situations they find themselves in. But I think if a woman is not conscious, it’s kind of obvious that you shouldn’t be having sex with her. Women also get “roofied” and such by men who count on a woman being unconscious so they can take advantage of the situation. I don’t think that means every woman should be walking around in restaurants and bars, with their own thermos that they bring from home. And sadly, it happens more than some expect. I also don’t consider some of the things you listed as “behaving like animals.” On that point, you and I differ.

      Many pedophiles were actually victims at one point themselves and harbor the pain and suffering from that experience. Does that mean you dismiss the enormity of the crime they commit? No. The cycle needs to be broken. People need to be accountable for what they do.

      If I am a recovering alcoholic and I go to a party where they serve alcohol, it is not the responsibility of the hostess to NOT have alcohol there. It is MY responsibility to not drink and to learn how to control myself, even if the temptation is so strong for me that I am salivating. Alcoholism is a disease and it often stems from something deeper, it’s usually a band-aid for depression or is used as an escape mechanism. So does that mean if I go and get drunk that I should not be held accountable if I drive my car and kill someone? After all, it’s an “illness.”

      I think we need to be really careful about how we classify this because of where it can go and how it can be manipulated.

      The points I brought up before about how women were treated in this world were actual examples of rape. the 15 year old girl in the maldives who will be flogged because she was continually abused by her father and made pregnant. The young girls in zimbabwe – some just infants, who are raped by men because of the belief that they will be cleansed of disease by “laying with a virgin.”

      The children are victims. They have no fault other than being born in the wrong place at the wrong time and to the wrong family.

      The example you bring up with child brides is a valid one and is something to be explored for sure, perhaps in another post.

      Thanks so much for your thoughts.
      Kiran

  • Nelson
    Twitter:
    says:

    This entire story has torn me up right from the beginning. These men should have been raised by my father. I guarantee that not one of them would have shown any form of brutality toward a woman if they valued their life. Some things we are taught and some things we learn. Rape is something that no man should, even or ever, think is OK. Doing so, makes you less than a man.

    It is stories like this that make me ashamed to be of the same sex.
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  • Thank you for writing about this, Kiran. Your writing was beautiful and sad…just haunting. This story is gut-wrenching.
    The Dose of Reality recently posted…Top 10 Ways We Will NOT Be Changing In 2013My Profile

  • Gem
    Twitter:
    says:

    Your post was very moving and realistic-so much that I held my breath till the end when I sadly found out the girl had died, so I knew it was not you. But your descriptions were so void I really do think I held my breath. I had heard of this rape and death and was saddened, but your telling if it filled me with more sorrow and rage, compassion, and a want to do something, somehow, to prevent further atrocities.
    Gem recently posted…women of my history: the sorrow, the strengthMy Profile

  • Laura says:

    This was incredibly difficult to read and absolutely right. It is as horrible as the intention behind it is beautiful. No human, no sentient being, should ever suffer like this. I have no other words.

  • Stacie
    Twitter:
    says:

    Beautiful writing about a heart-wrenching subject. Thanks for sharing.
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  • Jamie says:

    Wow. What a horrible story. Your words brought that poor young woman’s nightmare to life.
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  • Mary
    Twitter:
    says:

    My heart is in my throat as tears pour down my cheeks reading your powerful/painful prose, your passionate story and the range of intense comments. Kiran, you are incredibly brave, articulate and passionate, and I’m honored to be getting to “know you” through your blog. Thank you for this important story and for the profound conversation you’ve initiated and hosted.
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  • Jack says:

    theREALdeal does not speak for men. There are more than a few of us who don’t make silly excuses about why rape happens.

    We don’t spend time trying to prove that women are responsible for wearing skirts that are too long, too short, too tight or too anything.

    We understand that sometimes there are situations in which we don’t understand what women are saying and that sometimes they don’t understand what we are saying but none of that excuses rape.

    theREALdeal makes me sick and disgusted with his foolish and ignorant remarks.

    I am the father of a daughter and I am horrified by this incident. I hope that something is done about this and that it is effective.

    Jyoti shouldn’t be forgotten.
    Jack recently posted…A Father Describes ParentingMy Profile

    • theREALdeal says:

      “theREALdeal does not speak for men. There are more than a few of us who don’t make silly excuses about why rape happens.”

      yawn. never claimed to. I speak for myself. and I don’t say what women want to hear just to get into their pants.

      “We understand that sometimes there are situations in which we don’t understand what women are saying and that sometimes they don’t understand what we are saying but none of that excuses rape.”

      Nothing excuses rape. but there are situations and conditions that *facilitate* it. Learn the difference.

      • Jack says:

        You are an abrasive and ignorant troll who is either intentionally stirring the pot or not smart enough to recognize your own shortcomings.

        So I am typing slowly and using small words for your benefit. You cannot blame the victim here. suck it up and go find a different house to haunt.
        Jack recently posted…One Step At A TimeMy Profile

    • theREALdeal says:

      “I am the father of a daughter and I am horrified by this incident. I hope that something is done about this and that it is effective.”

      Right. just as long as it’s not an honest, open discussion, right?

  • theREALMFdeal says:

    “1. A woman STATING she WANTS to be taken against her will…IS CONSENT!
    By saying it’s a mixed message, you don’t seem to understand how language/communication works. The woman stating she wants to be taken against her will…is simply stating, TO THE PERSON OF HER CHOICE, that he has the CONSENT, at in initiated time, to take her by surprise. Since the woman stated her fantasy, it DOES NOT mean, that if she was walking down a street, and a man (or group of men) pulled her onto a bus and raped her, that IT ISN’T RAPE! Which is the situation we have at hand.”

    I’m only going to respond to this, because I knew it would come up.

    Of course the woman in Louis CKs story didn’t want to be raped! but she wanted it to FEEL like rape. That’s why the joke is funny!

    In her mind she gave consent, but HE DIDN’T KNOW THAT UNTIL AFTERWARDS. She didn’t give him the consent (even though she gave it to herself) because she wanted it to “Feel real”… but not “be real” (from her POV) but it wouldve BEEN REAL from his POV! get it? That’s whats so F*CKED UP about it!

    So we hear stories like this (and like I said, I think this woman is part of a large group of women that act this way) and we also hear, “No means no”. So what is it? No means no? or No means you want it to feel like rape but really you’re giving consent?

    She didn’t say she wanted it until afterwards! Go back and listen to the clip!

    Every other response has been a completely misconstruing, which is fine, I dont care whether people agree with me. but more importantly, it’s just going to ensure that it happens again. If people just react with “horror” and “vigils” and have their “hearts go out to the victim” it’s just going to repeat itself. Oh wait. It already did:

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57563746/another-bus-gang-rape-reported-in-india/

    There’s too many to respond, very few people (if any) have taken the time to really understand what I said, and no one wants to have the “complex conversation” we are all too happy to give dorky white boys with AR-15s.

    Rape is not about sex, but it’s not simply a violent act. It’s about sexual power, humiliation, and preys on that which women covet the most: their sexuality. Otherwise the guys on the bus couldve just smashed her with the iron rod and be done with it.

    Oh by the way, I’m not saying women are at fault for being raped. but the women around here are at fault for not understanding what Im saying

  • theREALMFdeal says:

    “Sad because the box used for the comments says “Speak your mind” but as soon as people do, they are judged by others who disagree and, instead of a constructive argument, what we see here is a bunch of comments full of insults and whatsoever.”

    Go back and see who insulted who first.

  • theREALdeal says:

    “If I am a recovering alcoholic and I go to a party where they serve alcohol, it is not the responsibility of the hostess to NOT have alcohol there. It is MY responsibility to not drink and to learn how to control myself, even if the temptation is so strong for me that I am salivating.”

    The more proper analogy is, if you are a recovering alcoholic, yet are continually bombarded by images of alcohol consumption presented in a positive light (ie, people having fun, partying, laughing, guys using it to get laid – think ‘most interesting man in the world – stay thirsty my friend’) yes it’s still “on you” to control yourself, but would be a lot easier and better for society if that environment was curtailed a little bit right?

  • Andrea says:

    What a moving piece. I am so glad that she has a name and that her father is showing other fathers that the rape of your child is not dishonor to you, rather it is dishonor to those who committed the heinous act. Thank you for sharing and for responding to the comments – while many of them were hard to read, it is good to know what people are really thinking – if even for a moment.
    Andrea recently posted…10 Of The Best Indoor Birthday Party LocationsMy Profile

    • masalachica says:

      Hi Andrea,

      Thanks for commenting. Reading that comment thread is hard and I know I may have lost my cool at one point on it. But you know, I am human. I am sad that people do continue to consider rape as a something that can be prevented if women just “acted a bit differently.” I feel like what a few of the comments lost sight of is that rape has little to do with sexuality and it pre-dates short skirts, movies, or whatever other things were said here around the “causes” of rape.

      You are absolutely right. It is good to know what people are thinking, no matter how disturbing. It forces you to ground yourself in your own thoughts and realize that you can’t become complacent about defending IMPORTANT things in this world.

      So, here’s to hoping we keep fighting the fight, not just for the young girl with a name, but for all the victims of sexual violence.

      xo,
      Kiran

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MEET KIRAN
I'm Kiran, I'm a dreamer. A writer. A singer. A mother. An ugly crier. An Indian-American. Who loves Gandhi. My stories are full of truth that is sometimes hard for me to say out loud. This blog is where I overcome my fears and live (and love) out loud. Read More....
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